January 18, 2022, 08:59:56 AM

Canberra in lockdown

Started by Toyota Camry, August 13, 2021, 11:37:03 PM

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Toyota Camry

October 18, 2021, 09:19:06 PM #50 Last Edit: October 19, 2021, 08:59:45 AM by Busnerd
While the lockdown has now ended in Canberra, and it is legal to ride on buses for fun, it is recommended that you continue to take additional precautions, including those in addition to the public health restrictions; for example, if you are riding on multiple buses in one day, you should wear two masks instead of one until the 90% double dose vaccination rate is reached, after this point it would be rational to wear just one mask, noting this will continue to be mandatory for years to come on Transport Canberra vehicles.

You will not need to wear your mask outdoors from October 29, however it is best practice that you continue to do so; additionally, whilst the NSW Government is making an extremely poor decision to end the indoor mask mandate from December 1, meaning that you may visit shopping centres and other businesses in Queanbeyan without wearing a mask, it would be extremely foolish of you to do so.

It is prudent to remember that when moving around in the Canberra community, you are surrounded by unvaccinated people; this is part of why I have not left my home except for visits to SPAR Ngunnawal and one trip to Kmart Gungahlin to pick up a click and collect item by bus, during which I was disgusted that a single door Irisbus Agoraline operated my service.

Shops and shopping centres will be reopening in Canberra from October 29; as we are now living in a new COVID-normal world, due to the risk of exposure it is best to avoid non-essential visits to shopping centres once they have re-opened, however it provides additional convenience that items may be bought in person from this date rather than only via click and collect. Buses will not be busy in Canberra for a long time to come in this new COVID-normal world; whilst some departments such as Services Australia may be trying to force staff back to offices, the risk profile will be too high for most people to consider working on-site.

ADMIN Note: The ACT Bus Forum does not support the wild views expressed in this post. For correct official information visit www.covid19.act.gov.au

narc855

Quote from: Toyota Camry on October 18, 2021, 09:19:06 PMyou are surrounded by unvaccinated people
Do you have evidence to support this?
What I can see is that we have 80.7% people aged 12+ get fully vaccinated today.

Sylvan Loves Buses

October 19, 2021, 03:57:21 PM #52 Last Edit: October 20, 2021, 12:51:17 AM by Sylvan Loves Buses Reason: 'Little to no' patronage, not 'much fewer'
Quote from: Toyota Camry on October 18, 2021, 09:19:06 PMthe lockdown has now ended in Canberra, and it is legal to ride on buses for fun
When was it not ever legal to do it for fun? Even though I may not have always been satisfied that I wasn't getting any Renault's during the lockdown (excluding seeing 943 and 969 on trainer runs), I consider most of trips to be quite fun, especially knowing that I'm increasing my numbers towards my ultimate goal. Sitting up the very back of an artic by myself and watching the front wheel turn as the driver maneuvers around a very tight corner very quickly without hitting the curb is quite exciting! You may not, but I considered all of my trips during the lockdown to have been essential, and I even made sure to go on buses at specific times of the days and on routes I know would have little to no patronage - keeping to Tuggeranong and Woden Valleys as that was all that was necessary.

Toyota Camry

I am extremely concerned by information at https://www.covid19.act.gov.au/ stating that the mask mandate on public transport in the ACT will end on November 26; this site is claiming the mask mandate will only continue in high risk settings such as hospitals and nursing homes beyond this date. It is strongly recommended that you contact your local MLA demanding an extension of the mask mandate on Transport Canberra buses and light rail services; I will be refusing to travel by bus if masks are not mandatory.

Barry Drive

Does it? (Might need the URL of the actual page or article, because I couldn't see any mention)

If it's true, it's not surprising - the mask mandate had to end at some point. IMO once we achieve a 95% or higher vaccination rate the risk will be low, and the CHO and Chief Minister have always adopted a risk management approach to their health directions.

Feel free to continue wearing a mask (or two) if you so choose.

Sylvan Loves Buses

I mean if you're really worried, you could just cover your face with masking tape. You won't be able to breath, but you won't catch anything from anyone.

Stan butler

Quote from: Toyota Camry on October 21, 2021, 09:20:03 PMI am extremely concerned by information at https://www.covid19.act.gov.au/ stating that the mask mandate on public transport in the ACT will end on November 26; this site is claiming the mask mandate will only continue in high risk settings such as hospitals and nursing homes beyond this date. It is strongly recommended that you contact your local MLA demanding an extension of the mask mandate on Transport Canberra buses and light rail services; I will be refusing to travel by bus if masks are not mandatory.

What is stopping you from still wearing your mask?  Plus you can choose to sit by yourself too.   So with those facets, then why refuse to travel via bus?

As a side note, will you also refuse to go into shops where there may be a mask less citizen.  Alternatively, will you refuse to go into a kfc if they are not wearing masks? 

Can you please answer these questions as I would really like an answer.  You have, many times come up with various recommendations, but you never come back to justify your points - especially when someone comes back with what seems to be a valid point that refutes your claims.  Just would like to see your reasoning on some of your posts.

Toyota Camry

Quote from: Barry Drive on October 22, 2021, 05:45:05 PMDoes it? (Might need the URL of the actual page or article, because I couldn't see any mention)

If it's true, it's not surprising - the mask mandate had to end at some point. IMO once we achieve a 95% or higher vaccination rate the risk will be low, and the CHO and Chief Minister have always adopted a risk management approach to their health directions.

Feel free to continue wearing a mask (or two) if you so choose.
This disturbing news is listed at https://www.covid19.act.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0007/1874473/PATHWAY-FORWARD-DOCUMENT-23102021-1026.pdf; this article states that face masks will only be required in high risk settings after November 26, which are listed on https://www.covid19.act.gov.au/stay-safe-and-healthy/advice-for-high-risk-settings and does not include public transport.

Other jurisdictions including New South Wales and now Victoria (this is reported today in the "Herald Sun"; a Melbourne newspaper) have committed to making the mask mandate permanent on public transport permanent on public transport, and are not removing it as part of their roadmaps; there is strong precedent being set by other jurisdictions in this regard, however the ACT and Queensland are both making the mistake of removing the mask requirement on public transport next month.

I will be continuing to wear a mask in public beyond November 26, as should others; it is extremely important that all persons are wearing a fitted face mask as the purpose of wearing a mask is to avoid the wearer transmitting COVID-19 to others, not to protect the wearer, hence it is not simply enough for myself to be wearing a mask if others are not.

Stan butler

Quote from: Toyota Camry on October 23, 2021, 09:40:53 PMI will be continuing to wear a mask in public beyond November 26, as should others; it is extremely important that all persons are wearing a fitted face mask as the purpose of wearing a mask is to avoid the wearer transmitting COVID-19 to others, not to protect the wearer, hence it is not simply enough for myself to be wearing a mask if others are not.

But will you refuse to go into a KFC if any of the staff and/or customers are not wearing masks?  This is an important question because the demographics of the majority of people in a KFC are either teenagers and/or people aged in their 20s - and also people who are deemed to be in a high risk contagious category due to their frequent proximity to each other, and should I say, their carefree attitude to others.

This is an important question as the answer may reflect on how we should be living from now on.

Toyota Camry

November 09, 2021, 08:41:08 AM #59 Last Edit: November 09, 2021, 09:49:17 AM by Barry Drive
Excellent news has been announced by ACT Health today; whilst masks will no longer be required indoors in other settings as of Friday, the mask mandate is being retained on Transport Canberra bus and light rail services, as well as for schools and hospitals; details are below.


Toyota Camry

In an excellent move to respond to the spread of a new variant in the ACT, the mask mandate has been reintroduced from midnight tonight; you cannot enter any indoor setting without a fitted face mask in the ACT, except for a private residence.

Disturbingly, the NSW Government is refusing to copy this, and masks are not required in Queanbeyan; many local businesses in Queanbeyan and Jerrabomberra are expected to lose customers to Canberra, due to the lack of a mask mandate in NSW.

https://twitter.com/ACTHealth/status/1473134063535857666

Bus 400

Why? Residents can still choose to wear a mask. 

Some companies in NSW are also introduced their own mask mandate including in offices.

Leaving it up to the business to assess the risk. 

What should be more concerning for yourself are the amount of ACT residents who will head to places like Newcastle, SW Sydney, South Coast, etc. Mixing with residents & visitors. Brings back various variants back Canberra.

Toyota Camry

Quote from: Bus 400 on December 22, 2021, 08:33:14 PMWhy? Residents can still choose to wear a mask.
You do not have a right to spread COVID-19 to others; forecasts are advising that NSW will have 25,000 cases per day by the end of January. It is likely that in any shopping centre or on any bus, a number of people will have COVID-19; it only makes sense that they not be permitted to spread it to others. It is likely during this period that hospitals in Australia will be over-run with patients due to this variant, and that positive cases may need to be flown to New Zealand for hospital treatment; any measure at all to reduce the number of cases during this period is absolutely necessary, including the possibility of lockdowns, similar to the lockdown that we had in Canberra between August and October.

Sylvan Loves Buses

Quote from: Toyota Camry on December 22, 2021, 10:13:26 PMYou do not have a right to spread COVID-19 to others

Where does it say that, I thought this was a free country? Obviously you'd have to be a psychopath to want to do something like this, but I never knew there were 'rights' when it came to covid. Compliance sure, but rights? please show me where it says that.

Busnerd

I doubt people would deliberately be catching a bus knowingly having Covid, it would more likely occur when people don't know they have it catch a bus so the statement is irrelevant.

Also hospitals will be fine, no one is being flown internationally for treatment, all evidence to this date prove this variant is causing extremely low hospitalisation rates despite its fast spread, who knows, YOU may have the variant already from only single masking last time you visited KFC.

ajw373

Quote from: Sylvan Loves Buses on December 23, 2021, 08:22:52 AMWhere does it say that, I thought this was a free country? Obviously you'd have to be a psychopath to want to do something like this, but I never knew there were 'rights' when it came to covid. Compliance sure, but rights? please show me where it says that.

Actually no it isn't a free country. We live in a country that has numerous rules and regulations that control our everyday lives for the benefit of the society as a whole. You are not free in this country or any country that I know of to do what you want when you want.

We could argue till the cows come home the appropriateness of those rules but that would be absolutely pointless. Besides for the most part this is why we vote in governments, who create the rules though regulation and laws.

But when it comes to masks in particular the core issue with leaving mask wearing up to the individual is that the benefit of a masks is to minimise the risk of a positive person passing it on. So basically if you wear one but a positive person doesn't there is little benefit to you wearing a mask.

The only way mask wearing works is by everyone wearing one, which means it really does need to be mandated.

Sylvan Loves Buses

Quote from: ajw373 on December 24, 2021, 10:05:20 AMif you wear one but a positive person doesn't there is little benefit to you wearing a mask

I've been wearing my masks everywhere I go and I still got something (twice), was probably due to this which is why I also feel that if we have mask mandates, there should be much more enforcement in place - police on the bus platforms and in the shopping centres etc.
I haven't got tested though as conveniently the Kambah site is drivethrough only...

Toyota Camry

Quote from: ajw373 on December 24, 2021, 10:05:20 AMThe only way mask wearing works is by everyone wearing one, which means it really does need to be mandated.
This is correct, and now is not the time to argue about restrictions; 189 new cases were recorded in the ACT today, with a forecast of 4000 cases per day in mid January 2022, this forecast may be viewed at the link below.

https://chrisbillington.net/COVID_ACT.html

Now is the time to limit all non-essential activity in Canberra; whilst the government has not yet declared a lockdown, which may occur next month, it is now of extreme importance that you avoid high risk locations, wear two masks and do not gather with other people unless it is essential.

Sylvan Loves Buses

I would hope that another lockdown occurs very soon, the numbers have jumped up very quickly in the past week even thought we were so close to being under 50 last week, damnit.
Dunno about two masks, but with this new varient I would prefer something that covers the whole face, know where I can get something like that?

Toyota Camry

Quote from: Sylvan Loves Buses on December 27, 2021, 05:05:13 PMDunno about two masks, but with this new varient I would prefer something that covers the whole face, know where I can get something like that?
It is an excellent idea to also wear a face shield; these can be purchased from Chemist Warehouse for $2.99. Below is a link to this product on their website; currently this item is in stock at the Woden and Belconnen Markets stores, but has sold out due to high demand at all other ACT locations.

https://www.chemistwarehouse.com.au/buy/102379/face-shield

Snorzac

Quote from: Toyota Camry on December 27, 2021, 01:27:04 PM
Now is the time to limit all non-essential activity in Canberra; whilst the government has not yet declared a lockdown, which may occur next month, it is now of extreme importance that you avoid high risk locations, wear two masks and do not gather with other people unless it is essential.
Show me medical evidence that double masking will work! Just buy a mask that does the job properly and there is no need to double mask. You don't wear two condoms.....


As for the lockdown talk, no. Simply no. At this stage of the pandemic we are seeing very few hospital admissions. Whilst sensible restrictions such as masks are a great idea, we do not need another lockdown. We are a highly vaccinated population in the ACT, the vaccine is doing its job in protecting against severe illness and hospitalisation and frankly as far as I'm concerned anyone that ends up in hospital as a result of not having the vaccine should be charged for their hospital expenses

Sylvan Loves Buses

I agree with the last sentence, also that face shield doesn't quite cut it for me. I'm more looking for something that'll cover the whole face and be more secure, like a plastic bag or something (not that I'd do that).

narc855

People are ready to enjoy their summer holidays after the pandemic, so why do we need another lockdown...

Sylvan Loves Buses

December 28, 2021, 03:06:45 PM #73 Last Edit: December 30, 2021, 07:05:36 AM by Busnerd
Because it was only a week ago that we were in the double figures and now we've almost shot up the the quadripple figures. Many people (myself included) are reaching that point where our protection from our second vaccine is wearing off, making us more vunerable. I'm only going out tomorrow and maybe twice in January, if I can't get a booster shot asap, I could be in trouble.


Snorzac

Or you could stop panicking like main stream media (and Toyota Camry) want you to and actually look at the facts for what they are. Look at the hospitalisation and not the total case numbers....that's the more important number at this point in time

Toyota Camry

January 02, 2022, 05:38:02 PM #75 Last Edit: January 02, 2022, 05:42:52 PM by Toyota Camry Reason: Spelling in error in the word "Irisbus"; this is now corrected.
506 more cases were recorded in the ACT today, as well as 55 in Queanbeyan; the positivity rate is now 1 in 7, meaning that a large number of undetected cases are moving around Canberra.

It is now time to take some personal responsibility, and place yourself into lockdown even if disturbingly the government has not done so yet; just because shopping centres, restaurants and clubs are open, it does not mean that you should visit them under any circumstances. If you are riding on buses, only do so if it is essential; only travel on quiet services and use Anytrip to identify if your bus will be a COVIDsafe vehicle such as an articulated, steer tag, light rail vehicle or Renault, avoid trips operated by rigid buses if it is at all possible, in particular the Irisbus fleet. Do not travel with only a single mask unless it is an emergency.

You may wish to consider travelling on quieter routes to avoid trips on smaller rigid vehicles; disturbingly, with the weekend timetable operating on many days during this holiday period, no articulated, steer tag or Renault vehicles are operating on many days at present. For example, if travelling from Civic to Belconnen, avoid the busier rigid buses on the R3, R4 & R5 routes; instead travel to Dickson using L1, and you may connect with quieter routes R9, 30 or 31.

narc855

If we enter lockdown again, what role do jabs play?

triumph

Toyota Camry mentioned Iris buses. Given that they are front door only and perhaps mechanically fragile, there would be some sense in only wheeling them out when all other options (except perhaps the near worn out Renaults) are already in use. But this doesn't seem to be happening. Illogical? Or is rostering and driving approvals and/or ad blue conservation involved in limiting the use of the bigger buses?

narc855

It does happen, irisbuses are the hardest chassis to see under this timetable.
However you can't use all Renaults but hide irisbuses as irisbuses are wheelchair accessible and climate controled.

In addition, it's good to remember that you can get on from front doors only in Sydney so that doesn't really matter.

Snorzac

Quote from: Toyota Camry on January 02, 2022, 05:38:02 PMDo not travel with only a single mask unless it is an emergency.
Again, please provide medical proof that double masking provides any additional protection than one good quality, properly fitted mask!

Bus 400

Since you're bordering on the same mentality as antivaxers. 

I'm going to need some peer reviewed medical advice to back up these claims.

The latest variant may be more contagious. But is less harmful, especially to the vaccinated without underlying health conditions. 

The biggest concern should be for those aged 10 & under who currently do not have access to the vaccine & those who are in a medical position that the vaccine is of no use & those with underlying health conditions. 
If you are in contact with anyone of these groups, then yes limit your movements. Before visiting these people, have a RAT test. If you're concerned, have a RAT test daily. 

Those that wish to ignore medical advice, can no pay the price for not getting vaccinated.

Sylvan Loves Buses

January 02, 2022, 10:44:38 PM #81 Last Edit: January 02, 2022, 10:44:52 PM by Sylvan Loves Buses
Quote from: Toyota Camry on January 02, 2022, 05:38:02 PMIt is now time to take some personal responsibility, and place yourself into lockdown
Already doing that.

Quote from: Toyota Camry on January 02, 2022, 05:38:02 PMonly travel on quiet services and use Anytrip to identify if your bus will be a COVIDsafe vehicle such as an... Renault
If only during the 2019/21 Christmas timetable there were more of these in the south side of Canberra. Only 1 comes down to Woden each day :'( .

Stan butler

January 02, 2022, 11:06:34 PM #82 Last Edit: January 02, 2022, 11:09:02 PM by Stan butler
Quote from: Bus 400 on January 02, 2022, 10:30:27 PMThe biggest concern should be for those aged 10 & under who currently do not have access to the vaccine & those who are in a medical position that the vaccine is of no use & those with underlying health conditions.
If you are in contact with anyone of these groups, then yes limit your movements. Before visiting these people, have a RAT test. If you're concerned, have a RAT test daily.

Those that wish to ignore medical advice, can no pay the price for not getting vaccinated.

I got 2 Pfizer jabs and I ended up in hospital in a rather serious condition.  While I am now out of hospital, I am still booked for extra tests in mid January so it is still ongoing. Resultingly, I am not getting the 3rd booster shot.  I don't care what others say and I don't care if anyone chooses to avoid me because I won't be fully vaccinated.  I do care for my health though and to me, what happened to me was very, very scary.  Happy to go into further detail if anyone wants to hear more.  I am not an anti-vac person, but in this case, my body didn't accept the jabs and basically got very upset and put me in emergency for a period of time.  I also lost a lot of energy too.

As a side note - I had no previous or underlying health conditions.  In fact my gp has always said my health and associated variables (ie blood pressure, cholesterol etc) is very good for my age.

The 2 mask theory is a furphy and all it does is starve your body and brain of adequate oxygen levels.  Masks are good in a way, but having adequate oxygen is more important.  People need to realise that one proper fitting, properly worn and suitably categorised mask is all that is required.  Note, I say properly worn and proper fitting.  Those people (and hipsters) with whiskers and beards are not getting any benefit at all by putting their mask over their facial hair. Faces should be clean shaven.  Plus, masks need to be suitably washed an/or changed every 4 hours.  If people wear the same mask for more than 4 hours then they are not doing themselves any favours.

Back to the first topic, I don't care what mandates anyone puts in place.  I am not taking the risk of any further jabs.  Instead, I am putting myself in lockdown and only coming out on an as needed basis.

narc855

Seemingly young people are easily getting sick from jabs (ie dead viruses) instead of activite viruses...

That also happened to me, I got fever after my 2nd dose while the last time I got fever was 2 years ago. However, I still think it is positive to get the 3rd doses (when it's avaliable to me as I am under 18).

On the other hand I agree that if you suffered from great side effects you may not receive any further dose. In addition, you can try to make a claim against government.

triumph

Quote from: narc855 on January 04, 2022, 06:56:06 PMSeemingly young people are easily getting sick from jabs (ie dead viruses) instead of activite viruses...

That also happened to me, I got fever after my 2nd dose while the last time I got fever was 2 years ago. However, I still think it is positive to get the 3rd doses (when it's avaliable to me as I am under 18).

On the other hand I agree that if you suffered from great side effects you may not receive any further dose. In addition, you can try to make a claim against government.
My understanding is that Pfizer and Moderna are more advanced technology not using 'dead [or live] viruses'. Presume you are referring to Astra Zeneca. As for substantiating a claim from the Government, good luck with that.

ajw373

Quote from: narc855 on January 04, 2022, 06:56:06 PMSeemingly young people are easily getting sick from jabs (ie dead viruses) instead of activite viruses...

That also happened to me, I got fever after my 2nd dose while the last time I got fever was 2 years ago. However, I still think it is positive to get the 3rd doses (when it's avaliable to me as I am under 18).

On the other hand I agree that if you suffered from great side effects you may not receive any further dose. In addition, you can try to make a claim against government.

You never get sick after having any vaccination.  You may well have symptoms of sickness like a fever, headache or temperature but that is you immune system working just fine rather than being infected.

This is an overly simplistic explanation but most symptoms you get when you contact a virus are actually the signs of your body fighting an infection. A high temperature is your body raising your temperature to kill the virus, tiredness is your body slowing you down to give it more energy to fight the invader.

With vaccines what they are doing is triggering your bodies immune system to teach it to be able to identify and fight a potential virus. This can of course trigger immune responses, aka the common symptoms people complain of.

In fact this belief that vaccines stop infection is not true. Vaccines don't stop infection but what they do is fight the virus before it takes hold and causes disease. If your immune system is working well you may not even know you have been infected as your body has fought it. If it is working moderately well you may get minor symptoms and if not working well at all the virus may develop into disease.

In the case of COVID, we mostly have our terminology the wrong way around. COVID-19 is not a virus rather it is the disease that is caused by the SARS-CoV2 virus. So when people go off for testing they are not really being tested for COVID-19 rather they are being tested for SARS-CoV2. Go figure.