Bus Discussion (2019-)

Started by ajw373, January 03, 2019, 10:52:25 AM

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Bus 503

Has anyone seen 381 recently? Seems to often be out of service for long periods. At least that's what I suspect, as I often don't see it or track it for long periods of time.


Sylvan Loves Buses

Quote from: triumph on December 03, 2019, 10:35:02 PM(Have yet to see or ride articulated, PR3, or PR2 on an R3; but have ridden 1 STAG running an R3. Very little opportunity now to ride PR2s and particularly PR3s on routes regularly used.)

That's funny, cause all I ever see R3s on are Volgren Artics and R4s but never in the direction I'm heading

I take it you are in the Belconnen/Gungahlin areas of Canberra. I've been surveying anytrip and spotting them around quite a bit recently. If you want to ride 2s and 3s just for the hell of it, there's quite a few being used around the Belconnen/Gungahlin parts in the very early parts of the morning 5-9am. Otherwise the general City area to Belconnen and Dickson and R7s during the middle of the day. 180s, R6s, 30s, 50s, 60s and 70s in the afternoon and evening - at least until the school term ends.

Barry Drive

#53
Triumph's post was correct. Artics are not to be found on R3s. (In fact, this was mentioned in budget estimates.) STAGs are also not meant to be used, but do so occasionally.

You may be thinking of R2 which does use artics a lot.

Toyota Camry

I believe that articulated buses are banned from the R3 and cannot be used in any circumstances; no member here has ever sighted one. Articulated vehicles did operate on the former 315 service to Spence, and also presently operate on the R5; my suspicion is that the section of route around Brindabella Park and Canberra Airport is not suitable for articulated vehicles.

King of Buses

Quote from: Toyota Camry on December 05, 2019, 04:45:35 PMI believe that articulated buses are banned from the R3 and cannot be used in any circumstances; no member here has ever sighted one. Articulated vehicles did operate on the former 315 service to Spence, and also presently operate on the R5; my suspicion is that the section of route around Brindabella Park and Canberra Airport is not suitable for articulated vehicles.

Actually, I've been on an artic operated R3 to the Airport and back, as well been on/seen artics on former routes 11, 792, 10, 737, 757, 786 to Fairbairn Park. So, they can do it, and occasionally do (as do STAGs), I'm just inclined to believe none are scheduled to operate the R3 for whatever reason (such as they're not really needed on that run, other than the City to Belconnen section which you can cover by putting those buses on R2s and R4s).

triumph

Last Monday a PR came past Spence shops outbound around 1 to 1.15pm. it appeared when a regular R3 service would be expected to come by. (The only other bus at around that moment was a blue bus displaying 'L'.) Unfortunately I didn't initially take much notice or get a good look, but it possibly was a PR3.
Can anyone confirm that a PR was on an R3 that day?

Sylvan Loves Buses

646 will be outta action for a while, got hit the other day by another bus driver pulling into Tuggeranong Interchange

Bus 400

Quote from: triumph on February 29, 2020, 12:10:26 AMThere are only two Hino Honchos Nos 100 and 101 for the new route 903 to Strathnairn. Looking at the TT for services starting this Monday, there are some run overlaps which means both Honchos are needed to run the service. This implies that, regular buses from the fleet will appear from time to time when either or both of the Honchos are unavailable for service.
It would depend on who is providing the drivers? Is the regular bus drivers, or the SNT/Flexibus drivers?

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Snorzac

The OnScene ACT Facebook page reported an accident involving a bus in Fraser today, pictures show BUS 450 with significant front end damage.

Toyota Camry

Quote from: Snorzac on March 01, 2020, 02:02:43 AMThe OnScene ACT Facebook page reported an accident involving a bus in Fraser today, pictures show BUS 450 with significant front end damage.
That accident happened at a blind curve next to an intersection on Shakespeare Crescent; as a safety measure, traffic lights must be installed at that intersection as a matter of urgency, the TWU should  refuse to allow any of it's members to operate route 42 services along the eastern half of Shakespeare Crescent at a speed higher than 15km/hr until this occurs.

Snorzac

I reckon it would be much safer if the entire road network were to be reduced to 15km/h speed limit and traffic lights at every intersection...

Stan butler

Quote from: Toyota Camry on March 01, 2020, 06:02:18 PMThat accident happened at a blind curve next to an intersection on Shakespeare Crescent; as a safety measure, traffic lights must be installed at that intersection as a matter of urgency, the TWU should  refuse to allow any of it's members to operate route 42 services along the eastern half of Shakespeare Crescent at a speed higher than 15km/hr until this occurs.

Do you have any statistical or empirical data that shows that this is a dangerous accident area?  I have only heard of only one accident involving a bus here and there must be over 50 buses a day that go past this corner.

Yes it is a blind corner, and with the perceived lack of data then I can only assume that most drivers, car and bus, are able to navigate through here without any issues (as I don't hear of other accidents).

But I am glad to be proven wrong - do you have data that proves or shows that many drivers are having accidents here.  Just like the corner of tillyard and ginninderra drive.  I see after many reported accidents, and a documented history of accidents, that this corner finally got lights and a better design.

So with this corner on Shakespeare, does the data exist to warrant traffic lights and a reduction in speed limits?

triumph

Quote from: Toyota Camry on March 01, 2020, 06:02:18 PMThat accident happened at a blind curve next to an intersection on Shakespeare Crescent; as a safety measure, traffic lights must be installed at that intersection as a matter of urgency, the TWU should  refuse to allow any of it's members to operate route 42 services along the eastern half of Shakespeare Crescent at a speed higher than 15km/hr until this occurs.
You have, haven't you, the benefit of the accident professional report, and of a traffic study detailing actual sight distances, 85percentile speeds in the through street, stopping sight distance, traffic volume (goes to probability), human factors, and funding priorities to inform your statement.

There are, in every probability, lots of locations with compromised sight distances and the like. The community can't afford to rectify the lot, so it comes down to priorities and the precepts that should have been learnt when learning to drive. (Those precepts also should make union imposed limits unnecessary, especially as licensed heavy vehicle drivers are trained and skilled professionals.)

Sylvan Loves Buses

You know there's a better solution than reducing the speed limit and placing a traffic light every 10 meters right?

All the government has to do is make it LAW that cars are illegal in the ACT (excluding taxis and other business vehicles), and make the whole place a Bus-Capital (instead of Bush-Capital). Sure, no one would like it, but for every 50 cars, you've pretty much got a bus load. The more buses we have the better, not only for the enthusiasts, but the environment! ;D

Sylvan Loves Buses

Quote from: SylvanLovesBuses on February 13, 2020, 05:39:55 PM
Quote from: triumph on February 11, 2020, 11:49:04 PMMay be other differences, didn't look for them.

Mostly just visual changes from what I've noticed so far - I'll keep my ears primed to hear if the engine/FX are any different.

Found another one:
Instead of the 60's styled Daleks, they're now using 2005 styled Daleks.


Saw 400 today and dayam it looks strange without its wrap.


Also got this from the other week bus 980.


Also now that I have a picture, I asked this before but got no answer, which buses did these white switches (some have buttons, same question) come from?

Bus 503

Any sightings of 500 in the last month? I haven't tracked it for a while.

Bus 524

What size is the VST's and Volgrens Side Destos?

Bus 524

Bus 495 has a new Stop Request Sign Fitted.

Sylvan Loves Buses

Why have TC made 943 and 944 trainer buses in the first place? I don't get it, cause they're not even using them as trainer buses - I Saw 976 and 977 the other day being used for that.
Here was I thinking the 'actions' made by ACTION were stupid...

Stan butler

Maybe to give new drivers an idea what it is like to drive a bus....ie the size, the manoeuvrability etc.  Driving an old bus around would give a good indication of the potential of new candidates as then the trainer can see if they can handle a vehicle of that size.

A quick question, how many people learn to drive in an old car (compared to the expensive family car)?

Buzz Killington

Quote from: Sylvan Loves Buses on April 18, 2020, 02:47:17 AMwhich buses did these white switches (some have buttons, same question) come from?

Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but from memory all of the .2's had a red 'flick' style stop button adjacent to the priority seating.

Over the years they would have just replaced damaged ones with whatever parts they had available, which would include some white ones.

Sylvan Loves Buses

So not from any particular bus, oh well.

@Stan butler - While TC still have the Renault's, they have to do that with their new drivers anyway. The reason I'm remarking on it is why would they bother having specific trainer buses and not even use them or why they'd take them off the road and assign them when they're just going to use others anyway. I witnessed 944 leave Tuggeranong Depot yesterday morning and when I got home I checked to see if it was on the radar anywhere (which it wasn't), so I assumed it was taken for its new purpose. I suppose they could've been using them as well as 976/977 the other day, but I only saw those two together on that occasion. It just bothers me when I see things like that, that's all.

Snorzac

From my experience the two training buses are only ever used for licence upgrades and the driving exam they take pre-licenced drivers on. Once formal training commences they will only use in service buses because they are fully fitted with equipment such as ticket machines and NXT bus whereas the training buses are not.

Sylvan Loves Buses

A friend of mine passed a bus crash on Drakeford near Oxley a little while ago, anyone else know which bus it was or see it happen?

Stan butler

There has been a few bus incidents in the last few days.  I personally know of 2 others in the last week. The weather may be one factor, but the increase of cars on the road too (also due to the weather), plus school holidays, more traffic on the roads - and general driver experience (both for cars and buses).  It was also a full moon the other day and I dare say some may blame that too.

One thing I do want to highlight, there seems to be an increase in aggressive driving techniques by cars in the last few months - ie, more drivers running lights, cars tailgating (not leaving adequate distance), speeding and off course not paying attention.  It just seems that driver behaviour in general has deteriorated so much in the last few months.  This observation is from someone who spends a lot of time on the roads.

One initial thought is that more people are on the roads now - maybe due to not catching public transport due to COVID concerns, as well as the increase in local population (hence more cars).  But this behaviour is concerning though.

Stan butler

Quote from: Snorzac on October 07, 2020, 02:05:32 PMFrom my experience the two training buses are only ever used for licence upgrades and the driving exam they take pre-licenced drivers on. Once formal training commences they will only use in service buses because they are fully fitted with equipment such as ticket machines and NXT bus whereas the training buses are not.

My sources say that is very close to the mark.  They need to take possible new recruits around in a bus to determine their aptitude (let's face it, some people just do not have what it takes to drive a bus).  It is best to find this out before they commence the formal training.  Plus, and as snorzac says, if the new recruit does not already have an MR license, then action will assess them using one of these buses.

Sylvan Loves Buses

Never thought I'd get a wiff of this again, but I guess it's all the same material in the end. 514's concertinas are starting to take on the same scent as the Renault artics did. So yay? I suppose...

triumph

Bit of trivia. Contemplating possible withdrawal of 490 (Yutong E12), it occurs to me that currently there is a solid block of consecutive fleet numbers from 301 to 721 of buses in service. Is this a record for a block of consecutive fleet numbers?

The block is a total of 421 regular service buses out of 464 in regular service, that is 90.73% of the regular service fleet.

Regular service buses not in the block are the remaining 41 PR100.2 (various numbers between 911 and 982) and the 2 Ponchos (100 & 101).

triumph

A relatively rare R3 sighting today, a bit after 5pm at Westfield Belconnen - 528 (a 'bendy') operating a S bound R3.

Snorzac

I think if you watch that trip every day you will find it is an artic every day :)


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Barry Drive

The Fleet Summary on ACT Bus Fleetwiki has been modified to show more details.

So, for instance, you can now easily see that the most common model is the Scania K320UB which makes up 37% of the fleet.

triumph

Today's Canberra Times Editorial canvassed the issues of heavy vehicle safety following reports of the inquest following a fatal rear ender by a medium sized lorry.

The writer refers to heavy vehicle ages and stated 'Some of the Renault buses on the ACT Action fleet are 35 years old'. Whilst perhaps some withdrawn buses might be that old, 925 is the oldest in-service bus and Fleet Wiki says first registered on 17th September, 1991. Therefore the oldest Renault still normally in-service is not quite 30 years old.

Also the general lack of modern safety equipment, such as ABS, autonomous forward collision mitigation, and driver real time monitoring, in older heavy vehicles was mentioned. This raises the question of what is fitted to the Action fleet and how that is evolving? Any knowledgeable comments?
I have twice been on buses on a warm afternoon where the driver was clearly struggling to stay awake, a fact one driver confirmed to me after I mentioned it. So the latest attention etc monitoring developed by Seeing Machines, a Canberra business now spreading internationally, seems not to be fitted and usefully could be.

Barry Drive

#83
Correct. No ACTION bus is currently older than 30 years.

ABS was first introduced to the Mercedes O.305 fleet – Bus 618 was the first. So, all buses have ABS fitted since 1983.

(refer: https://www.actbus.net/actions-1983-fleet )

The Scania K series also have ESC and Traction Control, but not sure about the other models.

Sylvan Loves Buses

Been wondering about this for many years now, but does anyone know or is able to find out which of the Irisbuses was used for the LifeLine ad from about 15 years ago? That ad where the guy gets off outside the Canberra Theatre and the whole City is deserted.
Any ideas? I've exhausted all of mine trying to find any references and I don't think calling the hotline is a good idea.

Bus 400

Quote from: Sylvan Loves Buses on July 15, 2021, 04:36:08 PMBeen wondering about this for many years now, but does anyone know or is able to find out which of the Irisbuses was used for the LifeLine ad from about 15 years ago? That ad where the guy gets off outside the Canberra Theatre and the whole City is deserted.
Any ideas? I've exhausted all of mine trying to find any references and I don't think calling the hotline is a good idea.
I've found the ad, can't see where the fleet number is shown though 


https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2ya88q

triumph

Quote from: triumph on July 01, 2021, 04:01:24 PMToday's Canberra Times Editorial canvassed the issues of heavy vehicle safety following reports of the inquest following a fatal rear ender by a medium sized lorry.

The writer refers to heavy vehicle ages and stated 'Some of the Renault buses on the ACT Action fleet are 35 years old'. Whilst perhaps some withdrawn buses might be that old, 925 is the oldest in-service bus and Fleet Wiki says first registered on 17th September, 1991. Therefore the oldest Renault still normally in-service is not quite 30 years old.

Minor correction. Post is dated 1st July 2021. Unknown at that date was that 925 and 2 others were retired the day before. Thus, correctly, the oldest in service bus in the fleet as at 1st July 2021 is 929, first registered according to the Fleet Wiki on 15th October 1991. 

Sylvan Loves Buses


triumph

Quote from: Sylvan Loves Buses on August 15, 2021, 10:59:18 AMSo what happened to 307?
Also curious as to why? it must have had a significant problem to precede PR2s into withdrawal; or perhaps a long term repair, seems unlikely. 

Barry Drive

As mentioned on fleetwiki, Bus 307 was not re-registered for 2022, so it's doubtful it will make a return.

Given their age, any major mechanical or computer failure with an Irisbus will not be cost effective to repair considering their written down value will be close to zero.

Whereas a similar problem with a PR100.2 would be easier to fix given their stockpile of donor buses.

triumph

Aha.... Thanks for response. So perhaps 307 is destined to become a 'donor' bus. (Given the pressure to meet accessibility rules, there must be an acute problem with it to precede non-compliant PR2s.)

triumph

Quote from: triumph on July 15, 2021, 11:05:53 PMMinor correction. Post is dated 1st July 2021. Unknown at that date was that 925 and 2 others were retired the day before. Thus, correctly, the oldest in service bus in the fleet as at 1st July 2021 is 929, first registered according to the Fleet Wiki on 15th October 1991. 
Another correction. Bus 927 has been returned to service to substitute for bus 307 (Fleet Wiki). So 927 is now the oldest bus in TC service, first registered 1/10/91 (Fleet Wiki). So, it is about to turn 30 years 0f registered age.

(As a matter of curiosity, is the all time oldest in service known?)

Barry Drive

927 is the oldest, based on build date / registration. But it hasn't been in continuous service.

Allowing for the time 927 was withdrawn, 929 should be regarded as the longest serving bus. Of all time.

narc855

927 became an exposure location now so we may not see it on road recently.
But how is the exposure time last for only 3 minutes...
Bus Route 28 Transport Canberra Code BUS410   Casey Market Town to Casey (Plimsoll Drive)   Public Transport   24/09/2021 - Friday   10:57am   10:59am   Casual
Bus Route 28 Transport Canberra Code BUS544   Casey (Whitrod Ave) to Casey (Plimsoll Drive)   Public Transport   24/09/2021 - Friday   9:28am   9:30am   Casual
Bus Route 28 Transport Canberra Code BUS927   Casey (Plimsoll Drive) to Casey (Whitrod Ave)   Public Transport   24/09/2021 - Friday   9:00am   9:03am   Casual

King of Buses

Quote from: narc855 on September 28, 2021, 01:02:01 PMBut how is the exposure time last for only 3 minutes...

You would assume because that's because the individual was only on the bus for that long.

triumph

ABC on-line news has an item about world wide shortage of AdBlue and more specifically its main component, urea. This additive is used to reduce diesel engine unwanted emissions. Apparently there is a risk of Australian trucking fleets being grounded early in the new year as supplies run out. Not only trucks of course, anything with a modern EU standard diesel can be affected. The item didn't explain why the engines couldn't operate without the additive, that is mechanical or compliance issues or both.

This raises the question of where Transport Canberra stands in respect of supplies on hand, and thus how long AdBlue using parts of the fleet can be expected to remain in service if the predicted lack of supply comes to pass?

Barry Drive

I couldn't find a contract for supply of AdBlue.

However, the contract for supply of diesel is publicly available. ACTION's diesel is supplied by Park Fuels (based at Albion Park Rail), who import diesel from Korea, Japan and SE Asia. Fuel is then trucked from Port Kembla to Canberra.

The contract requires that both depots have a minimum of 5 days fuel in the tanks.

I would assume, therefore, that the AdBlue tanks at the depots also have a 5 day stockpile - although the buses themselves will probably last several days without refilling, unlike the fuel tanks.

So while there may be a two week buffer before AdBlue runs out, should there be a critical shortage the supply of diesel could be affected first if there were to be an inability to transport diesel from Wollongong (or elsewhere).

Toyota Camry

There is in excess of 120 vehicles in the Transport Canberra fleet that do not require Adblue; these include the gas bus, Renault & Irisbus fleets, which may be topped up with additional Renaults from the Fyshwick depot.

This will alow for an enhanced Saturday timetable to operate daily during a complete shortage; enhancements may include additional trips on suburban routes after 6pm. Whilst the carbon emissions per trip will increase due to only operating these fleets, and mask requirements will need to be tightened due to the crowding that will occur; this is still preferable to no service being provided.

Bus It

Based on the WIN News article which was later shared on ACT Bus Facebook, reference is made to 90 buses (including CNG) being retired over the next 3 years. Given that we have 37 active PR2s and now only 18 Irisbus left that implies that we may see up to BUS 355 being scrapped within 3 years  :o . Is it just me or does this seem a pit premature and unnecessary. I've always thought the CNG Scania's have a fair bit of life left in them. Maybe I'm wrong  :-\

Barry Drive

#99
The plan (which has been mentioned here), is to first lease 34 buses to (mostly) replace the 37 Renault PR100.2s. The outcome of this tender should be known soon, with buses presumably coming early 2022.

The next step is to commence the tender process for 90 electric buses. As the number suggests, these will replace buses 301 - 391 but will take place over the next 5 years. The first of these buses may arrive by late 2022, but it would be maybe 3 or 4 years until all 90 are delivered: so the last CNG MAN will possibly be withdrawn in 2026.